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gloomyMoron · 09-10-2017, 02:21 PM

(I'll wait for others to weigh in but unless something major comes up, I'm sticking with that because that sounds rather peachy.)

smuchmuch · 09-10-2017, 05:24 PM

The plan sounds good to me.

Still doesn't change the fact that even unshifted and weakened, Pioneer is still going to be the most fortified position we're going to assault to date tho, with tons of tanks, the red note who cn kill anyne who hear t through radio made in region 4 (which assume would be the case of any radio or speaker in Poneer and a mini region 4 who could unleash... hell if we know. So I expect casualties to be higher than normal (to be fair our norm /is ridiculously low considering the assimetry of forces...)

Hypevosa · 09-10-2017, 06:14 PM

I believe I may understand the macroscopic workings of this device now. Observe how the "vanished" phase orb is at the root of the tree - and is also the only orb that is not physically connected in any way to the structure. When this base was first being constructed, this was placed here as the root to transform from. Then after basic construction was done and the dummies were established was when the second node was placed, or branched off naturally. Then when the base was fully established was when the third was there.

I believe that what we are observing is not a matter of dimensional shift, but temporal shift - or perhaps the device is instead a sort of "save game" device that stores and can restore state of its surroundings.

Can we somehow date the age of the concrete from vanished phase and see if it is "older" than that of the other phases?

When it shifts to decoy phase, can we have the seeker drone go knock over some dummies and see if they are restored standing up? the next time decoy phase comes around?

If my theory is correct, then assaulting the base while the phase maker is active will result in either soldiers being irreparably lost as they're "erased" when the save is loaded, or if it's really temporal, we're attacking "future" versions of the base and we have no idea what could come through from the future versions (likely far worse things).

Also, if we simply remove vanished phase from the device by knocking it out with the seeker, we could either toss the base into eternal limbo, or perhaps stabilize phasing such that there are either only 2 phases to deal with, or stop the transition all together.

Or maybe the device blows up.

Either way I think we should try knocking that suspended but not connected middle orb out of the device (which represents vanished phase) and see what happens.

smuchmuch · 09-10-2017, 08:23 PM

...That's a very complex theory you spined from just the for of the thing but besides the fact is does kind of remind a dial, I see no evidence to support it.

Hooowever, this is a good point you bring. Why not blow up the phase shifter when the base is actualy shifted ? Leave it standed in whichever other dimesion...

I am also curious, what does our resident AIs ans rescues (that'd be Hawkeye and RealSmith) have to say about the 'Empty Grave', sounds ike something of interest.

And the phase shiftr turn people into monsters, uh ? I wonder are we talking of 'Poluteds' (see post 48 of this very thread), or something complelty new ?

Dragon Fogel · 09-10-2017, 09:25 PM

Good catch - the description of how Polluteds are created matches up with this pretty clearly. Doesn't explain the mystery hair, though.

The main thing that has me on edge here is a lack of horrific monstrosities in evidence. Given past experience, that's more likely to mean "we haven't found them yet" than "they aren't around".

If they aren't actually on the base, Professor Veriso is probably the one who can send them in. Also, it would not be surprising in the slightest at this point if he was an Author-empowered abomination himself.

Dis_Aster · 09-11-2017, 08:05 AM

Yeah, I wouldn't exactly be surprised if Veriso has attained a Dominator form by now. And if that's the case... I'd ask if we can improvise any means of freezing him.

Hypevosa · 09-11-2017, 01:30 PM

(09-10-2017, 08:23 PM)smuchmuch Wrote: »...That's a very complex theory you spined from just the for of the thing but besides the fact is does kind of remind a dial, I see no evidence to support it.

The author's bodies, devices and symbols tend to be metaphorical. It's in their very nature as authors.

Here you see something very universal; a tree, this one has 2 branches. One of which is weaker and thinner (the decoy phase) and one of which is very robust (the active phase) and one of which that seems to only serve as a template (vanished in the middle).

I believe given the thickness of each, we can maybe say that it's closer to a "save state" device than using some time travel. Since the save state for the full base has many people, with lives, experience, and overall tons of "data" it is a larger, stronger link. The template in the middle may just be what is used to determine the area which the device will affect, hence why the concrete(?) foundation is there during vanished phase.

The "hairs" could be leftover tendrils of whatever is reconstructing and deconstructing the "save" states. (or, my first theory was that it's what's at "the other end" of the device that would destroy our soldiers when they phase there).

If we can knock over the dummies in decoy phase to see if they are righted before they come back, and if we can observe if soldiers are actually moving at all between phases rather than being deconstructed and reconstructed in exactly the same spots, then we could glean more knowledge about "what" this thing is doing exactly.

If we don't really care, I'm fairly confident that un-rooting that middle sphere is the key to either turning off the device or destroying the base, or both. The worst case I've thought of is that unrooting it *may* mean we end up "loading" whatever is an "empty" dimensional space instead (if things are indeed "going" somewhere) and we may get to see what has the tendrils. I don't think that will be the case though - I believe since a save "space" is no longer specified it just wouldn't work anymore.

Mayu_Zane · 09-24-2017, 08:55 AM

(09-10-2017, 08:23 PM)smuchmuch Wrote: »I am also curious, what does our resident AIs ans rescues (that'd be Hawkeye and RealSmith) have to say about the 'Empty Grave', sounds ike something of interest.

Hawkeyes: Never heard of it.

Iggy Smith: The Empty Grave is a dimension meant for temporary storage. We stopped using it because every time we looked back in there, something was always missing. A belt buckle. A bullet. A book. Sometimes the thing that disappears is as a whole stack of corned beef. We stopped when corpses went missing.

You: What was causing it?

Iggy Smith: Never figured it out. Popular idea was that the Empty Grave wasn’t actually empty; something invisible lives there and it’s been doing who-knows-what with the stuff we put in it.

Rainhar: Hmmm… does it have a connection to the Polluted?

Iggy Smith: Yes, actually. Polluted keep trying to drag people into it. Don’t know why, because there is no direct connection to the Authors, far as I can tell.

So there’s another kind of entity living in this ‘storage dimension’.

(09-11-2017, 01:30 PM)Hypevosa Wrote: »If we can knock over the dummies in decoy phase to see if they are righted before they come back, and if we can observe if soldiers are actually moving at all between phases rather than being deconstructed and reconstructed in exactly the same spots, then we could glean more knowledge about "what" this thing is doing exactly.

The dummies, as far as your troops can tell, don’t return to their original positions when the ‘Decoy’ phases back in. The real soldiers are also moving in-between shifts, so they must be active while they’re in another dimension. Whatever this thing is, it doesn’t seem to affect time.

After your soldiers spend time observing this strange army base, a familiar voice is heard on the radio. You instinctively shudder when you realize what it is. It’s the Radio Entity. The Red Note.

Radio Entity: Welcome to the new and improved show, ladies and gentlemen! Season Two! Get excited!

You: Oh no.

Red Note: We got some new rules! Our sponsor, the Veriso Company, wanted to spice things up a little, so who am I to argue! Questions of Loyalty now has a new show format! First off, EVERYONE CAN BE A CONTESTANT! Yesiree! We open up opportunity for everybody to get the GRAND PRIZE! A free trip to the scenic Red Note Amusement Park! Ain’t that great, folks? NO QUESTIONS! That’s right, we just pullin’ names now! No barrier to entry!

Ghulls: Vora? We can’t jam the signal!

Red Note: Human, saramis, cat or dog, everybody’s welcome!

You: Shut off all the radios!

Everyone on the ground obliges, and thankfully, the Radio Entity is no longer heard.

Rainhar: This is going to be a problem. As long as this thing is out there, we can’t co-ordinate in real time.

Feathers: Veriso has somehow altered this creature to be even more dangerous. I recommend we find out where the entity’s physical body is and destroy it.

Your costumed hacker down at HQ yells.

Kuroda: Hey, what the hell?! The Red Note evolved???

Rainhar: More like our professor Veriso figured out a way to make it even more dangerous.

Lagantis: Has it been listening to us this whole time?

Kuroda: Ugggghhhh I really wanted to forget about this thing…

Feathers: Commander. I have a request. Please let me and Francoise listen to the entity. It has no power over non-organic life. The Red Note causes lungs to stop working and we have none. Connect us to the radios on planetside.

You think about it for a moment, and approve. The two synthetic advisors listen for about half an hour, and they share some information:

- The Radio Entity knows everyone’s name, and the names are selected at random.

- It has been actively listening since the Seeker drone entered the basement.

- It genuinely believes it’s hosting a radio contest show.

- The EMP-proof radios offer no protection at all from its effects. The Radio Entity actively seeks active radio devices and ‘forces’ its way through.

- The ‘new show format’ is that of a raffle; a random name is chosen and that person is the new target.

- It can only kill 1 person at a time, and does not require the question to be answered to activate the Red Note effect. It does need the target to be listening to the radio, though.

- Feathers and Francoise are ‘invisible’ to the Radio Entity. It showed no indication that it was aware of non-organic listeners.

Francoise: Commander, the Radio Entity’s physical vessel is hidden inside the base. We recommend dealing with it first. A small covert force can eliminate it, as long as they maintain radio silence. It will be in the shape of a red piece of paper, perfectly square.

Feathers: We also have the option of destroying the Phasemaker when the enemy’s base is in its ‘Vanished’ or ‘Decoy’ state. All projections indicate that this will result in Pioneer Base being stranded in an alternate dimension indefinitely. The Radio Entity will also be a non-issue.

Rainhar: Or we could try to kidnap Veriso and interrogate him first.

Lagantis: This is going to be risky. We can’t use radios at all without taking casualties.

Rainhar: Hold up. Maybe we can, I don’t know, use lights for signaling? Flags? Flares

Lagantis: We could do that, but the enemy can easily see what sort of commands we’re relaying. Drums and trumpets? No, the moment guns start firing those become worthless.

Rainhar: Grrrr… and we can’t use Usurpers either since their signals are blocked by solid things… Damn this Radio Entity!

Lagantis: We could plant explosives inside the base, start a fire and then force the occupants out. Smoke ‘em out. If they have fire extinguishers, Spec Ops can disable them first.

You consider your options. The Radio Entity is active and your are uncertain of what the base’s layout is. What order will you give?

- Send in Spec Ops to kidnap the professor.

- Send in Spec Ops to destroy the Radio Entity.

- Send in Spec Ops to do a full recon of the base’s interior.

- Destroy the Phasemaker.

- Steal the Phasemaker.

- Assault the base without the benefit of radio.

- Assault the base with radios on. (Casualties inevitable)

- A combination of the above.

- Something else!

>_

Units available:

SpoilerShow

smuchmuch · 09-24-2017, 11:07 AM

Quote:Rainhar: Hold up. Maybe we can, I don’t know, use lights for signaling? Flags? Flares

Lagantis: We could do that, but the enemy can easily see what sort of commands we’re relaying. Drums and trumpets? No, the moment guns start firing those become worthless.

Uh maybe that'll sound silly but ... what about texting ?
Would it be hard had to configure and securize some pads so they can transmit images and text, maybe buzzing and make it so they can send some very simple codes with just a few fingers movement ?

(I mean I'm pretty sure it is possible technicaly, afer all you could do it with modern day tech easily, it's just designing the interface, securing the connection and training the troops to use this system quickly enough that would be the sticking oint. But I believe our spec-ops are already used to comunicate with finger movement while cloacked so if w base our image on this, this coud go quickly.)

-------------------------------

I know you deemed it too risky Gloomy, but I don't think we're gonna escape some inflitration works here. The red note needs to be neutralized one way or nother and we need to have an idea what else await us
And for that our best bet s to capture the good doctor

So I'll reitrate and edit my previous plan here:

1)We have Keymaster open a portal in pinonneer during the 'normal' phase. Sadly we'll have to take a shot in the dark as to where in the base.
2)Soon as the portal is opening, we send some flashbad and EMP iswe have such, that should neutralize any guards or camera watching.
3)Spec ops slips in, release a bunch of the newly develloped SID drones slipps out. the portal closes

edit: 1 to 3 bis) Can SID drones be adapted to do a bit of diging ?
Because if they can we could just burry the drones just like the bomb we intend to use to enutralize the phase shifter during the 'empty' phase and then have them emerge during the normal phase, map as much as they can, go back to their original hideout when the base about to shift.
That would spare us havng to create a blind portal and risk our spec ops at least at first.

4)The drones send info back the the AIs at base. Map as much of the base as possible in twenty mnutes (sixty if they are unous enough to be able to work without guidance when the base will be shifted otherwise better to get them to hide and then self destruct or desactivate) if they can locate the good professor, all the better.
5)Then after another cycle of base cycling, when it goes back to normal phase again, we can have keymaster open another portal (this time in a safer place determined from the data we'll have gotten from the drones) and send our spec ops to capture the good professor in twenty minutes.

Of course we could also use the bomb we planted as a distraction/way to stop the shifting cycle too but I'd rather keep it for our /main assault.

Honnesly the potential cons here (and that's assuming a very worse case scenario on all front here, mind) are numerous, i'll admit:
-We loose a bunch of experimental drones. Annoying but not tragic
-The ennemy discover we have this tech. Since this is the first time we use it and it has limitd aplication for infiltration and wetwork, it's not a huge loss of the element of surprise here.
-The ennemy discover we have portal tech. that would be a much bigger problem but as I said, if we neutralize any cameras or witnesses at the end of the portals we open (and it's the kind of ting spec ops are good at) we should be able to avoid that.
-We loose a spec team. That would be tragic but...I'm still well willing to risk it rather than the sure loss ofcuntless soldiers should we try attacking Pioneer with no radio or with the red note litening and who knows what waiting.

I think the risks of going in blind for the assault outweight the risks the operation

Ajnin · 09-25-2017, 07:46 PM

SpoilerShow

Priorities:
>Disable Red Note.
>Capture or otherwise neutralize Veriso.
>Determine if there's anything besides regular Smith troops waiting for us.

Can we develop drones with cloaking technology? Sounds like they'd be great for scouting areas like this.

smuchmuch · 09-26-2017, 06:47 PM

If memory serves, only the caste of wisdom (the sypergenius Saramis scientists that live recluse in thir own stations and stuff) know how the cloacking tech works.
... However come to think of it, those clocked suit have to be repaired and even maintained once ina while. No way they're being sent back tot he wisdom caste for that so...
And we have Grenda doomcat suit which use a different kind of cloaking but while the human federation lend us grenda I doubt they'd see kindly at us copying the tech.

But even if it was possible, id don't think we have /time to research and devellop clowked drone for this op. Which is why I'd rather use Rheynar SID since they are to bbecomepleted the day day after in game and can be rushed litterlay this in game day²

Ten11 · 09-28-2017, 02:29 PM

Hey uh, if its not too much of a hassle, could you please update the mspfa mirror? At least up until the point this thread starts. Downloading a dropbox file to read an adventure is really cumbersome.

Mayu_Zane · 10-02-2017, 10:42 AM

(09-28-2017, 02:29 PM)Ten11 Wrote: »Hey uh, if its not too much of a hassle, could you please update the mspfa mirror? At least up until the point this thread starts. Downloading a dropbox file to read an adventure is really cumbersome.

Oh man, I actually forgot about this: https://mspfa.com/?s=289&p=1

The last updated archive was in 2011. This is going to take some time. If anyone else is willing to help me out with this, feel free to PM me.

The next update: 6 October 2017

Mayu_Zane · 10-05-2017, 10:41 AM

(09-24-2017, 11:07 AM)smuchmuch Wrote: »1)We have Keymaster open a portal in pinonneer during the 'normal' phase.

2)Soon as the portal is opening, we send some flashbad and EMP

3)Spec ops slips in, release a bunch of the newly develloped SID drones slipps out.

4)The drones send info back the the AIs at base. Map as much of the base as possible

Keymaster opens a portal to the base’s interior. Your troops throw in an EMP and flashbang, but they are spat back out.

Keymaster: Living. Things. Only.

Annoyed but determined, Spec Ops 1 enter through the portal and they find themselves in an unoccupied room. Some kind of food storage. No cameras either. It seems we’ve lucked out this time. Your soldiers deploy the prototype drones, which automatically scan the base. Your invisible troops return to base via portal, and everyone waits for the map intel.

After about five minutes, the prototype SIDs finish scanning the base and send back maps of the interior. The AIs, Francoise and Feathers, add labels based on the most likely uses for the rooms within.

[Image: SaRhWlM.jpg]

Feathers: Scans indicate there are 29,900 enemy troops within. There are also 60 Hovertanks, all stored on the first floor.

Ghulls: Wait, what’s with that enormous bedroom?

Feathers: It is as it says. It belongs to Veriso. From recordings within the base, he may no longer be human and requires a lot of space. To the scans, he looks like a bulbous mass of flesh with no limbs. He’s 5 metres tall and 4 metres wide.

Lagantis: I guess we can rule out abducting him, then.

Rainhar: Hmmm… we could just… plop a portal under him.

You: Rainhar?

Rainhar: What? If he’s huge and immobile… we could just drop him into HQ. No risk!

You: We don’t even know what he looks like. He could be some kind of blob that spews out acid or mind-controls people. He could be in Dominator Form.

Lagantis: Regardless of what he is, we now know the layout and troop numbers. Does the laboratory contain any hidden monsters?

Feathers: No, general, but there is something else.

Lagantis: What is it?

Feathers: The laboratory is completely electrified. There is also a gatling gun stored inside it, attached to the antennas outside.

Francoise: Our best guess is that it’s an anti-Darangium point-defense system. There are hidden hatches on the first floor and the roof directly above the gatling gun.

Rainhar: So their plan is to just shoot the shell as it comes down from orbit?

Francoise: It’s fairly simple and crude, but if even one of the gatling gun’s bullets hits, it would be enough to protect the base from a direct hit. The antennas may be tuned in to detect the specific radiation coming off of the shell. Scans indicate no living operator, so it must be fully-automated.

Feathers: We have also confirmed the location of the Red Note. Fire or simply tearing the red piece of paper should be enough to kill the Radio Entity.

Okay. Veriso is some kind of giant creature. There is a gatling cannon that can shoot down the Enderfist’s artillery. We also know for sure where the Red Note’s physical body is. What’s our play here?

- Take out the gatling gun first, then begin the assault in earnest by opening a portal just outside the base.

- Destroy the gatling gun, then threaten the enemy with an Enderfist strike.

- Destroy the Red Note first.

- Open a portal into Veriso’s bedroom and kill him.

- Open a portal into Veriso’s bedroom and abduct him.

- Destroy the Phasemaker.

- Something else!

>_

Units available:

SpoilerShow

gloomyMoron · 10-05-2017, 12:06 PM

Is the Generator one tall room or are there two generator rooms? I also don't see a Backup Generator room, so if we take out their power they lose most all of their automated defenses. It's probable Phasemaker will still be active, because Author Bullshit, but if we take that down with a timed charge we can take down the generator room at the same time. The instant the power goes out we drop (last I remember we were running kind of low on Enderfist Artillery rounds for the week but I might be remembering wrong) a few Enderfist strikes onto the base. A couple should be aimed for the hatch the minigun rises out of to make sure that damage is done.

So... essentially:

1.) Prep a timed detonation device (set it for like 30 minutes or whenever the base will reappear into normal space next cycle) and send in a small group of people from an Engineer Corp and one of our Spec Op teams (just in case) to Phasemaker. It should be a quick in-and-out mission taking no more than 3 minutes, at most. Barring fuckery that is.

2.) 30 seconds before Phasemaker kabooms we send in a Spec Ops team (preferably a different one than the one that escorted the Engineer team... we wanna try to limit exposure to this place as much as possible... just in case) to take control of the Generator room and shut it down. A small contingent from the Spec Op team should then go to try and deal with Red Note as fast as possible.

3.) When the Phasemaker and power are both down, we EFS the base. Aiming for the Laboratory and the ramp down to the ground floor (if we can collapse part of the building onto the ramp, their tanks are trapped).

4.) We begin the assault in earnest. Our armored divisions and support vehicles should have started moving well in advance of this attack. The forces that are marching on Pioneer will put the base on higher alert, but that also benefits us because it'll make the next bit more effective.

5.) Through use of Keymaster we open a portal in the "empty space" area of the ground floor and start sending in troops. The first battalion through secures the area (setting up to shoot at the barracks entryways with a couple of our rocket troops making sure the ramp is collapsed). The second battalion through should secure the armory immediately. Additional battalions are used to reinforce and make sure we retain control while our armored divisions and the rest of our ground troops approach.

All of this should be planned around the Red Note's game. If memory serves, it does its game thing every hour or so. That means that we should start the operation as soon after one of its games and the base returning to normal space as possible. If we have to wait a few cycles of the base for these two events to line up, then oh well. Ideally we want to deal with them when we have the longest window to deal with them and limit their ability to respond. For this purpose our armored divisions and traditionally moving battalions should start their approach during one of the base's phased states (this gives us a head start).

Dis_Aster · 10-05-2017, 01:32 PM

Hrm. A solid plan, though I am a bit concerned about the gatling gun having a power source separate from the base's generators, just so they aren't left as sitting ducks on the odd chance that we do manage to disable the generator without them knowing. I wouldn't be surprised if North's men were paranoid enough to account for that, especially given that, if I recall correctly, Pioneer base was pretty much considered a mini-R1

...Also, on the subject of potential threats. Do we have any idea where the hell Max and the seven Tri-Cores that went to Falcobeak are now? Did they fuck off to Pioneer or is their current location a mystery? I don't recall really hearing anything about them after Falcobeak sent its forces after us while we were dealing with the whole Cobalt City situation.

smuchmuch · 10-05-2017, 01:47 PM

So their enderfist strike protection is a gatling gun that shoots explosive before they can reach down. Fair enough, (would have used a big laser personaly) ... Except while it would have worked well against the Durangium shells, it won't do anything against ordinary metal rods dropped from hgh orbit, which we can now throw at 'em thanks to hakweyes modification on the enderfirst

And maybe i'm missing something major (possbly related to the phaseshifter) but ... Why are the hovertanks parked on the first floor when the armory and workshop are the entrance one ?
I mean if there were tanks on both floor that'd make sense but here might as well park them all down so they can react quicker to an attack.

And the base has these great large spaces that are hard to defend. They know their enemy can use invisible stealth teams in thermo optic camouflage that is neutralized by water (and they know it, that's the reson this base has a moat), you'd think some military planner would finaly figure tight corridors and choke points with pressure plates and sprinklers.

That said 29 000 and 60 missile hovertanks are nothing to sneeze at.
Funy but where all the AOD nightmare stuff has been very scarry and all but franky fairly inneficient, this, regular tank and troopes in large number and efficiently deployed, may be the most legit threat we've faced to date.

Could we get our spec ops to sabotage someof these tanks ?

Quote: Do we have any idea where the hell Max and the seven Tri-Cores that went to Falcobeak are now?

Don't think so.I'd be willing to bet they are either back to region 1 or went to ground in region 5 given the 'fortress' that was supposd to be built there.

Quote: The instant the power goes out we drop (last I remember we were running kind of low on Enderfist Artillery rounds for the week but I might be remembering wrong) a few Enderfist strikes onto the base.

Not much a problem since we're at the last day of the week anyway. I know it's good to have some in reserve but here, this is an exceptional big enough targets.

Quote:3.) When the Phasemaker and power are both down, we EFS the base. Aiming for the Laboratory and the ramp down to the ground floor (if we can collapse part of the building onto the ramp, their tanks are trapped).

They're hovertank tho. (and yes I know it's not antigrvty, it's mini jets but it's still giving them a lot of mobility), they might be able to 'jump up' or down some obstructions and obstacles. If memory serves they were able to ift out of the tunnels near Barbarossa
While it's an excellent plan, we should count on it delaying the tanks rather then fully blocking htem

Hypevosa · 10-05-2017, 02:31 PM

Rednote has a pretty gigantic room

I'm almost willing to bet that rednote's room has alot of anti-fire stuff in it and/or red-note is laminated or otherwise protected from being easily torn. Maybe he's in one of those super nice collectible card holders? Or better he's acting as a book marker in a library and just slipped between some pages to never be found.

I think we really want to make sure it's gone no matter what we do to the base and want comms up for when things go wrong.

Do we know anything more about the room that the Red Note was in or do we have to send someone in for more intel?

Dragon Fogel · 10-05-2017, 05:15 PM

Hey, wait a second.

We're in their food storage.

What if we just, destroy all the food?

We're not really looking to starve them out in a long siege, but they don't know that. Could be a useful diversion, at least.

And yeah, I had the same thought as smuchmuch about our metal rods. Their defenses are based on the idea that we'll fling Darangium shells and we have a setup which doesn't do that now, so, why not use it.

Probably a metal rod will be pretty devastating to what it hits, but it won't really have significant splash damage like the Darangium. So... how about we hit that generator with it?

smuchmuch · 10-08-2017, 07:25 AM

Quote:Rednote has a pretty gigantic room

I don't think the map is entirely up to scale (also it's good to remember a fair bit of which room is which is Fethers and Francoice guesswork). Otherwise either those toilets and howers are kind of gigantic compaed to the amory r workshop, or those baracks and that food storage are seriously small for a base containing 29 000 soldiers, they have to be seriously cramped in there.
(... which come to think of it is possible, The reason there is so many troops s because all the troops remaining in region 4 have converged there, it's possible it's not meant to hold that many people normaly.)

Serioulsy that's the population of a small but ot negligeable town in there.
Wait actualy...

Quote:We're in their food storage.

What if we just, destroy all the food?

We're not really looking to starve them out in a long siege, but they don't know that. Could be a useful diversion, at least.

This could seriously work.

... With 29 000 troops, the way North army treat their recruit like crap, the phaseshifter giving everyone headaches, we wouldn't even need to wot for thm to starve (and once again, with nearly 30 000 people that would happen /quickly), I think a troop rebellion could happen in a matter of days.

Especialy if we get rid of the red note that keep the soldier to terrified to rebel. (but even with it, it can only kil on soldier per hour, there are thousands of them, they could v ery well do the job for us.)

Plant explosives on the generator, destroy the food, let simmer a couple of days, we may not even need an assault.

gloomyMoron · 10-08-2017, 05:02 PM

I mean, sieging them out is an option. It is one I considered but I feel like that'll just force whatever hand they have to play. Remember "Operation Godzilla"? Smith's troops just.. threw down their weapons and walked towards us. They're pretty indoctrinated. It is likely that if we attempt to starve them out, they'd just leave the base to attack us directly which also works to our benefit really, but I'm trying to limit the amount of bloodshed here. It is easy to surrender when you've been clearly shown you are outmatched than if you are starving and not making rational decisions.

So... our options are currently: Assault the base fast and hard or Take out their supplies and siege.

Frankly, I think either path would be interesting so... I'm fine with either, even if I'm slightly more partial to my own idea. <.<

Edit: Maybe we can run our ideas by Lagaan? He's the strategic mastermind general, after all.

Ajnin · 10-09-2017, 05:51 PM

Adding to the siege idea - Drop some radios in the building and have some AI's do some counter-propaganda once the siege starts. Tell them that surrender is an option and we'll treat them with dignity and understanding. We know the grunts never read the AoD.
We'll need to get rid of the Red Note first so that this would be an effective tactic, though.

Hypevosa · 10-10-2017, 12:08 PM

I love the siege idea, and it would be an interesting change of pace - I feel like this is something Lagantis would suggest as well.

My only issue is if big bulbous flesh man is another giant brain psychic or something that he could just make a portal out of there, or that wherever the base goes when it shifts dimensions has reinforcements or supplies.

I still think rednote has a huge room for a piece of paper, it seems entirely unnecessary unless there's something strange about it or the room.

EDIT: That said, maybe we could use Keymaster to teleport most/all of the food rather than destroy it? Or maybe get him a large quantity of meat he can consume?

It's all composed of various cells and likely covered in various micororganisms - if that's considered living enough to teleport.

~~LoverIan~~ · 10-19-2017, 01:57 AM

Alright so I got caught up and...

>Keymaster: Do you require an unobstructed view of the portals directly next to you? I'm thinking we should at least get you an armored casing of some form to reduce risk that someone could even throw a rock through the portals and kill you. While I'm aware that you can teleport most fire away....
>Hey R&D, crazy idea, but what if we make some sort of pack animal to transport resources through a portal, or furthermore is there a biological coating we could give rods and durangium that would allow it to be teleported?
>Oh and further what sort of methods could we use to safely kidnap Veriso? If they're in Dominator mode, Alone can just eat them if we can't make them useful in any other form, correct? (this is assuming they've even read AoD)

(Also depending on how rapidly portals (and how many) can be formed, we could each barrack, one by one. The non-organic parts of the barracks will be transported away, but we could also put portal entrance end to end to transport all barrack troops to a prison of some sort.
There's always the option of opening the hatch and having troops shoot some sort of heavy demolitions to collapse the second floor of the base onto the first, or even into the basement, to start the assault.
Another option we have is to disable the gun, and then deploy a shell in a way that will highly damage the upper left gym, barracks, and also damaging the ramp, preventing them from safely deploying hover tanks.
We could also just drop rods if they'll penetrate the roof, and form a sort of fence that will prevent hover tanks from leaving
Either way I would actually like to see what we can do about teleporting all of the food out, such as creating portals within canned goods to 'drain' the cans.)

Anyhow....
1 Deplete food stores as rapidly and completely as possible without detection.
2 De-activate and properly sabotage (so that they can't reactivate) the gun
3 Somehow jam their communications with anyone outside the base
4 Kidnap Red Note and Veriso
5 Inform them that surrender will be met with dignity and all that
6 Drop a shell or a series of rods to render hovertanks useless
7 Siege
>Lagan how does this plan sound? All we'd need to do is get a better assessment of how they're protecting Red Note

smuchmuch · 10-19-2017, 03:29 AM

Quote:Remember "Operation Godzilla"? Smith's troops just.. threw down their weapons and walked towards us.

I asume by 'drop their weapon', you mean their fortified and heavily armed position, because rereading this part they certainly kept their rifles and they were shooting back even while advancing.

And yes Smith troops are pretty damn endoctrinated but the they still needed things like the red note to keep from deserting* show that they can desert. As we've now seen twice beween the afomentioned Cobalt operation and now Hayes divison. (Which in itself is something we can use for our counter propaganda)

*(remember before it's upgrade, the red note could only speak through region 4 made radios so it was made to stop Smith soldiers from deserting at first not against us, as almost had a first hand demonstration when we made Kuroda and a few others officiers desert to our side in Cobalt)

i'll be honnst tho, I think no matter how we handle the stution, some bloddshed will happen. And when it does, Iat the risk of sounding cold, I would rather see a repeat of operaton godzilla where the enemy abandon their lofty heavily fortified positions and the slaughter is unilateral rather than an assault were our troops risk some huge caualty as well as well.

The only real problem with a full on siege would be time (the more time we spend, the more North nightmre factory can produce new monster, his whole strategy hinges on it) but that's way less a factor if we destroy their food supply (then the siege will alst a week at much before they are forced between stravation, surrender or desesperate sortie), generator (which would close any watar purifiaction if they have any) and the phase shifter. And even less if we can incite mutiny

Quote:So... our options are currently: Assault the base fast and hard or Take out their supplies and siege.

Frankly, I think either path would be interesting so... I'm fine with either, even if I'm slightly more partial to my own idea.

The two idea are not necessarily mutually exclusive, in fact. Nothing stops from a first roundof sabotage, sieging for a few of days and then if it seems it won't work, assault the weakened fortress in,the dead of the night.

Quote:Edit: Maybe we can run our ideas by Lagaan? He's the strategic mastermind general, after all.

Don't forget Rheynar, he is the man who broke a seemingly untakable siege with weaponized Diareah if memory serves. He's very good at thinking outsie the box.. or breaking into the box would be the case here.

Quote:>Keymaster: Do you require an unobstructed view of the portals directly next to you? I'm thinking we should at least get you an armored casing of some form to reduce risk that someone could even throw a rock through the portals and kill you. While I'm aware that you can teleport most fire away....

Actualy they couldn't and it can't since It only let living things and what it consider their 'clothes' through. As we've seen when our spec ops tried to throw grenades through the portal and they jsut bounced, any projectile unles they somehow contained organic matter wouldn't go through the portal.
(Not that I would put past, North troop to devellop some biologicl guns and bullet eventually but in the meantime...)

That say I do agree with the idea and still say we should put it in a dummy APC, if not for protection t least to hide it from view of any potential spy that might ever manage to make it near.
In I restate that everry author forge tech should be disguised/hidden, like say in some of those decoy vehicels we can build at the omni factory or in dones shaped diguises before being deployed. The later the ennemy an confirm we have author tech on our side, the better.