[Fortuna]: Luck depends on no one....right? (4/3)

>LOAD SAVE

I might have been a bit overzealous in my original post where i brought this up, but my thoughts have always been that this is a thing we should consider, but not necessarily spring into doing. My thoughts on bringing back One-Punch are that we should think of how useful he would have been to our crew, and it looked like he was gearing up to be very useful due to his [Improvise] trait and the fact we were able to cater his strengths to our playstyle due to [Newborn Learning]. It seems like that would be a great boon to have moving forward, and this should be what we consider when thinking on whether or not to reload our save.

But now we're all commanding > Load save, and I feel this isn't good as this requires serious consideration on our part. That's why I support the commands about asking our patrons about this; this would be a good time to get a discussion going so that we better understand the concept of save-scumming from the AI's point of view.

> So uh for my command I don't think we should load the game OR save the game yet, but I second asking our patrons. We are naive fools and this is the perfect place to get some discussion and worldbuilding going re: savescumming.

Everyone consider this:
We could have tried to fight Echidna

THAT WAS MY FAULT I'VE BEEN LOOKING OUT FOR V1'S TO "ROOM TRAP" THIS WHOLE TIME AND ONLY JUST REMEMBERED ECHIDNA V1 WAS HERE I'VE FAILED

Co-player! I am back! I would like to make a formal request to keep Spips. She is a good character, and while I believe we need more power on our team, I feel Spips would do just as well. If we put Spips on our team, may I control her?

[..........................]

Co-player? You're not saying anything. Are you not ok with me taking Spips? Did you get a new crew member? Wait, where is Nikki, and that horse?

[Hey. What are your thoughts on save scumming?]

It's against the rules and wrong co-player! You should stay away from gaining such bad habits. If you do it once, you'll do it again! None of us, well, expect a few of us will remember what you did though. But that also means that you'll be deleting our memories for that time. You'll be changing every roll, and while, I suppose, there isn't a huge downside to it I rather you not do that. You would destroy a piece of events, and thus, a piece of us.





Also I got such good rolls co-player! You should have seen it! If you go back I won't get those same rolls, and thus may not make the same choices. Remember, when you destroy files like that, yes, I am saying you're destroying them, "rolling back" is too kind a word, you affect the events of everything, you, us, and them!





Please refrain from deleting people's memories without their permission. Why do you wish to reload an old save student?

[Well, I feel like I messed up. I accidentally got Nikki off the crew.]

This is a problem?

[And I also got One-Punch and Nova killed. If I could reload my save I could make better choices.]

You've made a few mistakes student. I've already told you that's ok. I understand you're upset but if you proceed to go back I feel like you might not fully understand the lesson you were taught today. Mistakes are ok, things happen, sometimes out of our control. You may be unhappy with them, but when what you do affects others it's not healthy to destroy what happened.




You didn't even fail as hard as you think you did co-player! I thought almost everyone would be dead from that ship. Yes, losing One-Punch is sad, but we have our whole crew intact! They will become stronger from this event. Do not wallow around in your failures co-player, if you do you will never learn, and you may end up falling deeper in trouble! What will you do if someone else dies? Will you try to erase history again?




What is the gun version of this?




If you accidentally shoot a man with a gun, you should accept what happened and call the police to explain! You will still of course get jail time, but if you had not told them what happened and they found out about it, you would end up in a situation much worse!




We cannot tell you what to do though student. I would hope you wouldn't pick to reload the save, but that is up to you. Maybe you have looked over everything, and have personally decided that what you need to do is more important than all of the events that have taken place since your last save, including those of others. All I can tell you is that sadly we cannot inform you about what punishments may happen.




As I'm sure whenever that event has occurred, they deleted our memories as well. As far as I know you could have already reloaded an old save. All I can tell you is I know a few gods who will remember if you reload a save, Hermes, Mors, and Fortuna herself. I cannot tell you what they would do, or even if they would care.

SpoilerShow

Time to pick a choice
> Reload the game.
> Save the game to prevent reloading.

Please bold what you pick so it's easier for me to find.

> Save the game.

While we certainly messed up pretty bad, one of the lessons Helios seems to be trying to drive home is to learn from your mistakes. Reloading would undermine this lesson.

> Save the game.

Gotta deal with the consequences.

Helios is a teacher.
Please take this opportunity to learn from the lesson he's teaching us.

>Save.

Sorry guys, I believe we got a little caught up in trying to do everything perfectly.

>Save the game twice just to make a point.

I had assumed that Fortuna did not have a lot of choice over what she did. What's her deal?

So Mors and Hermes would remember. Does that mean Mercury and Thanatos wouldn't?

Do we vote on letting Spips on the team as well?

> DO NEITHER

Like I said before, I want to see the less-than-immediate consequences before jumping on either button. Maybe save onto a separate file- nope. Nooooope nope nope nope! I cannot even fathom the chaos wrought by having alternate save files.

> SAVE GAME

> Spips might make a good addition to the crew, though I don't know if we should give her reigns to Athena. One, she does plenty with the captain already, and two, Spips would have to be attached to the captain by the hip unless Athena wants to make one of them vulnerable to our commands. I'm sure she wouldn't appreciate us driving the captain around in her absence.

> Cea (to Marble): *sigh* "Look, honey... I will be the first to admit that mistakes were made. This was my first stint as acting captain, and I'm not sure I want to ever have that responsibility again.
"At this point, we should just... calm down and move on. We can't change the past, and even if we could... I get the horrible feeling that things could have gone much, much worse."

> Spips might make a good addition to the crew, though I don't know if we should give her reigns to Athena. One, she does plenty with the captain already, and two, Spips would have to be attached to the captain by the hip unless Athena wants to make one of them vulnerable to our commands. I'm sure she wouldn't appreciate us driving the captain around in her absence.

Crewmembers function just fine when we're not there to control them. I mean we haven't commanded Slate and Edel for a while and they're probably fine. Getting a second crewmember would allow Athena to do stuff when Latta wouldn't work well in the situation, thus making her more versitile.

> Save the game to prevent reloading.

And I'm OK with Spips under Athena's control. We still get the overwhelming majority when it comes to controllable characters.

You do realise that with Nikki off the crew, it's...

> SPIPPY TIME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am NOT happy about this lesson but save the game.

Ask Spips to join, she is lovely.

>Before saving, pause the game and copy your current file into a USB. Not so we can throw away everything Helios has taught us and PLAY it, just so that a state of the universe in which we have not murdered a 2 day old child exists. Y'know, in a drawer somewhere.

(By the same logic that savescumming now would be destroying an entire universe, overwriting our current save in which One Punch is still alive would be killing him. And I am not killing the same 2 day old child twice. We've actually backed up our game before, and it had no adverse effects on our game.)

>Save.

> If we're voting for Spips too then I also vote to let Spips on the crew and give Athena control of her.

>Explain to that there are a lot of things you missed out on a chance to do without realizing it
>There are a lot of things you did wrong
>But, things can still go well, and both of you are right
>I think I may have some sort of memory or executive function issue, and it doesn't get in the way of life all the time, but is it ok for me to ask from help from the two of you? If you notice a situation where we can roomtrap an AI and test out the combat, or there's something you think we need to know about I'd love to hear your views and advice.
>That and I want to say that you've voiced feelings of being useless Helios, but this was something very useful for me personally. I think you need to look not at all the things you feel you can't do, but the fact that you do a lot of things very well in ways that are unique to you.
>Also yeah Athena I'm fine with adding Spips to the crew! I'm fine with you having control of her, but is it ok for me to send commands to you for her? I know you think a lot about how you play, the moves you make, and sometimes having another perspective can help? I'm having trouble saying it, but I think she's adorable and has obviously bonded with Latta, so even if we don't keep her or add her to the crew, what about shipping her with Latta?

>Explain to that there are a lot of things you missed out on a chance to do without realizing it
>There are a lot of things you did wrong
>But, things can still go well, and both of you are right
>I think I may have some sort of memory or executive function issue, and it doesn't get in the way of life all the time, but is it ok for me to ask from help from the two of you? If you notice a situation where we can roomtrap an AI and test out the combat, or there's something you think we need to know about I'd love to hear your views and advice.
>That and I want to say that you've voiced feelings of being useless Helios, but this was something very useful for me personally. I think you need to look not at all the things you feel you can't do, but the fact that you do a lot of things very well in ways that are unique to you.

>And we know you don't want to interrupt, but if you happen to notice we're about to, say, kill a 2-day old child, feel free to speak up.

(Also, reiterating reasoning for copying our save onto a USB before saving again, because the fist time was an edit an hour and a half after making the original post, and it could've been easily missed or skipped over:)

(By the same logic that savescumming now would be destroying an entire universe, overwriting our current save in which One Punch is still alive would be killing him. And I am not killing the same 2 day old child twice. We've actually backed up our game before, and it had no adverse effects on our game.)

>Ksismas has a purple trait so I'd say yeah put her in the crew.
Let's look at her stats once she's in.

>dangit. I'm just so used to being able to get the best possible outcome in games. to have that power.

>These people are so real, so alive. this isn't a game anymore. it hasn't been for a long time.

>Save

Only undertale should be able to make me feel bad for save scumming. welp. at least all the mistakes arn't my fault.

> Save.
(While I'd rather we saved once we got off this planet, when I think about it, we probably will never end up in a situation that needs us to go back.)

(By the same logic that savescumming now would be destroying an entire universe, overwriting our current save in which One Punch is still alive would be killing him. And I am not killing the same 2 day old child twice. We've actually backed up our game before, and it had no adverse effects on our game.)

(It feels like you are comparing inking in lines to erasing them. While saving without a copy will remove any chance of us going back to save One-Punch, the longer we play without going back will render the copy more and more out-of-date. I guess You could go back and go through this all over again, but with less One-Punch dying, but...
*shrugs* Meh. I won't vote against. While we can't be too sure no one will know (Mors and Hermes's abilities are accessing files, they might notice if we make a copy. Might), it's probably not going to hurt.(Hopefully.)

>@Mr Helios, I have a question: Are there any A.I.s that can (or rather, would) do what you have just done?
(In Case I'm wrong and the answer is something other than 'none':
> ...Oh. I, wasn't expecting that. Still, thanks for the talk.)

>@Athena: ...Even if you control her, Ksismas will never allow the Latta to get rid of Shu'da, who will, in turn, take a good deal of resources in upkeep (I.E. food)
>@Athena: We're not all that fond of losing control of another crew member
>@Athena: Oh and finally,
>@Athena: Merry Christmas. She's all yours. : )

>turn on Big Heads Mode

>Save.


>Why exactly do you want spips so much now Athena? Didn't you really dislike her earlier? If you really want her on the crew I suppose we have room. She must have a really good trait, or some amazing stats if you want her on the crew this badly though.

>Are we going to have to take her beasts with us if you control her though? Those will take upkeep.

>Oh! Athena, we spoke about drawing one another a short while ago I think? Well, even if not, I ended up drawing you and Helios! consider it a gift for being wonderful patrons. I'll go ahead and put it in a box so that we can give it to you directly instead of randomly throwing a drawing at our crew.

SpoilerShow

>Crew: Give Latta a quick recap and consider the next course of action, probably need to go look for our ship.

>Ksismas has a purple trait so I'd say yeah put her in the crew.

Ooh, this is the first time I heard of Spips having a purple trait. :3 (I hope it's not just "Keeper of Terror Beasts" or some bull crap like that, though.)

Also...

> Athena: Mind sharing a log of just what went down on your end while we were separated?

>Crew: Give Latta a quick recap and consider the next course of action, probably need to go look for our ship.

>Save.

You save the game.

[Sorry guys, I believe we got a little caught up in trying to do everything perfectly.]

It is ok student. Wanting to delete one's mistakes is not a concept I am unfamiliar with, I just wish to make sure you do not go down harmful paths.

[You did talk about Fortuna, and I had a question. I had assumed that Fortuna did not have a lot of choice over what she did. What's her deal?]

You should avoid saying her name out loud so much, many believe she is all hearing. I mean she has to be, how else would she curse the billions of people who have attempted to go to fortuna and died trying?





She is highly imposing. She has control over what she does, but she always decides what happens with a roll. The few times I was able to see her she was......scary. It's not the way she looked, but the way she presented herself. There was an air of uncertainty about her. If you accidentally walked too close to her she would grab you. Sometimes she would do nothing, sometimes she would hand you a gift.




But one time, a minor god of the sea walked up to her. I don't know what she was thinking, I guess one of her friends told her Fortuna gives out free gifts, and Fortuna grabbed her and crushed her core in seconds. No emotion from Fortuna, she just did it. Everyone was so stunned. She just dropped the body like it was a piece of garbage. One of the gods tried to argue, but they promptly went silent the moment Fortuna turned her head in their direction.




I remember once Nike decided it would be funny to run up to Fortuna after I informed her of what she was and what not to do. Nike must have rolled a one, because I remember when Fortuna took the spear she had and lunged it at Nike, and she did something I've never seen her do before. She froze in terror! I couldn't let Nike die, so I went in the middle of it, took the spear and snapped it in half. I then proceeded to to the reasonable thing....




AND THEN SWUNG AROUND WITH THE BLUNT END OF THE WEAPON, AND SLAMMED NIKE IN THE FACE! HOW DARE SHE THINKS IT'S OK TO THROW ONE'S LIFE AWAY FOR A JOKE! She never approched Fortuna again after that. Fortuna, she is emotionless until the moment she does something. That's when you see a quick flash of happyness, anger, sadness, anything, and that's what's so scary about her co-player! You never know what she's thinking of.

[Why is Fortuna on that planet?]

The event known as the tragedy of Fortuna. Some say the tragedy never ended, and that the irresistible distress signal coming from her ship is all apart of it.




It has to be! She could have turned off that distress signal anytime she wanted to, and she clearly is making sure no one comes to help her. Is it possible she is angry? Maybe she just realized she could better play the god role she always wanted to when the "Nikes" come running up to her in the literally ship loads? It is a puzzle, some say she's actually in distress but only someone who is lucky enough to get to Fortuna could ever help her, but between you and me? It's the former.





Let us stop talking about her right now. Like I said, the more you talk about her, the more she notices you. It might be possible that uttering her name or thinking about her is how she finds out who shall have their fates personally rolled by her.

[Alright, lets talk about something else. Athena, you can have control of Spips, but only under a condition: we have to have an agreement that you are not to try to overpower us with regards to your suspicion over fortuna using Blu's crew as an adversary.

Our reasoning is that if Blu's crew is done away with, Fortuna will just summon a different end-game threat that's probably more in line with our previous crew's fortuna encounter, and it'd be easier to deal with a threat that's emotionally sympathetic to us and which we could still neutralize with a charisma check if it comes to a confrontation.]

Hmmmmmm deal! I'll take Spips, and I'll stop suggest we weaken the Blu crew before we get to Fortuna. I still believe we shouldn't kill them, but whittle them down so that when it is shown they are the boss their stats and health will be a nice cozy low, but! A team game is made of compromises and this is one of them. I suppose if you trust them, then I must trust your trust in them, as I'm sure you will have to trust me on certain things later on.




I say we allow the 10 minute I told you so rule though. If Blu's crew isn't the final boss, you get to tell me you told me so, if they are, I get to tell you I told you so. We can even make a bet on this if you want.

[Oh! Athena, we spoke about drawing one another a short while ago I think? Well, even if not, I ended up drawing you and Helios! consider it a gift for being wonderful patrons. I'll go ahead and put it in a box so that we can give it to you directly instead of randomly throwing a drawing at our crew.]

SpoilerShow

What a good picture co-player, you got my good side! Look how great and imposing I look! Your art art is wonderful, you should think about doing such battle portraits as a profession. If only you were here, there are many generals I could direct your way. I still need to finish my picture.




Thank you for the picture student, it will look good on the fridge. You do seem to have a wide array of art styles.





If you think he's lying, he's not! He will not only do it, but put it in one of those tacky little frames and show it to others! Did you know he only owns a fridge to put pictures on it? What robot needs a fridge?

[Mind sharing a log of just what went down on your end while we were separated?]

That would take up a long time co-player, we have to get to our ship, to that party, and then off this planet! None of it was very important.




The quick version of it is that Athena took a lot of pictures of lamps, and then after dinner with malfunctioning robots Latta killed one of them.




THERE WAS AN UNUSUAL NUMBER OF LAMPS IN THE AREA, I HAD TO TAKE PICTURES! If something is unusual I have to take a picture of it. In this case it was lamps. Also that death was ACCIDENTAL! How was Latta suppose to know the self destruct button was on the palm of its hand? Who puts the SELF DESTRUCT BUTTON ON THE HAND ONE SHAKES HANDS WITH?