Frozen Hearts Mafia [Family Ties - Mafia/Survivor Victory]

Or more accurately, day end flavor could ever actually impact the game?

I'd hope that wouldn't be the case, that'd be terrible design.

Turn your nose at flavour all you like, but TehPilot did design this game with a conceit to use flavour tidbits all over the place (bananas, trash, photos, house-burnings, voyeurings, doctorings, cloakers) and there was so much that didn't get aired on D5 when Granola did correctly surmise just how close you were to endgame. (Sadly MYsLinchandKingmake isn't a gamestate the mod will reveal to you).

D5 should've been massclaim time where you pooled all the observations and tried to figure out what the hell everyone had been doing. I really don't think it's that much of a stretch for "janitorings, flavourwise, are mixups at the police station" to implicate a player whose flavour puts them at the station. It wouldn't have been a sure thing earlygame because of all Dini and others, but I think it's a valid check against a slightly more powerful role.

Is it a general sentiment among the town players of this game that "Flavour X Happened in the night" is not something worth mentioning or pursuing? (chiefly directed at Eido, and also Oz who inadvertently had a lot of dirt on my slot)

I view 'flavor is just flavor' as a mod and a player, generally, because otherwise mass claims break the game, or at the very least make it inherently -fun.

I guess we're in different camps then, seeing as I disagree with you but acknowledge it's entirely a matter of subjective opinion.

homework homeowners

I wasn't going anywhere near flavorclaiming. I completely (and rightfully) believed scum still had oblits and any more town deaths was gonna doom us.

Flavor's nice but it's also nice when it doesn't automatically lock you out of a possible fakeclaim (~FERROUS WHEEL~)

Although in this case it probably saved me because I'm pretty sure "Vanilla/Lyncher for policechief candidates" wouldn't remotely have given me the survivability of "twoshot amnesiac"

Jesus I'm still wrapping my head around how stupid of a claim that was

The FERROUS WHEEL was the best weapon ever why would you want to hide it.

But in all seriousness, I do my absolute best (and my sense for it has sharpened over time) to ensure the For Fun flavor does not give away serious hints to things. I decided to incorporate a couple of lynched and other "deceased" characters (example: Lowell) at some points as a means of making a more interesting narrative. I do feel the flavor-heavy narratives tend to fall into really similar archetypes, and it seems taking a different approach to storytelling in mafia games paid off in this one.

The flavor thing was mostly a mechanical thing (meant to be an overabundance of useless information), and didn't have much involvement in the day start and end flavor (save for the housefires and possibly the daykill flavor, which I need to tweak how I handle the flashiness of daykills as to avoid accidentally giving things away).

@Schazer: I wanted to murder you for that Doc claim D2. I didn't even protect Dini that night!

Did you just forget about that claim on later days or....

I was planning on bringing it up the day we lynched Nola, but Schazer replaced out and it didn't seem like I'd get much questioning a replacement for the gambits of the person they replaced. So I started the day lynching Stiq who hinted at being a Cop D2 too.

(Sorry, I know I keep going on about that lynch, I'm just frustrated I never got the chance to intervene while it was still going on.)

That's me with the donut lynch.

...people read day end flavor?

I do read all of it in Pilot's games, because it's always awesome. But I agree in that it shouldn't matter at all. Clearly a wrong stance to have this one time. Damn that obviously fake in hindsight marker claim.

Haha okay I've been reading QTs and yeah this was a hilarious game after all. My own dumbness aside, this game really was chaotic from all factions. And I do still feel proud to have daykilled scum even if it was something anybody else could have done.

Note to self, though: Always go with the safe option.

@Cat

Post count doesn't matter when your posts are completely empty.

You had the same impact on town if you didn't make a single post.

It's exasperating to play with because you can't form a read on a player if there's no content to read them based on - so you're forced to just eventually lynch or vig them based on them being an empty slot that could fit into every single scumteam, if you have a lot of town reads.

I'd call that more active lurking than pure lurking, but...it's still lurking.

Just because I'm not very forthcoming with information doesn't mean that I'm lurking. I definitely always try to keep myself looking at least a little bit suspicious, and every game I'm just trying to hit the sweet spot of "too towny to lynch but too scummy for the mafia to nightkill". That's just my style.

Holy shit I was popular night 2.

Schazer which rhythm games do you feel you kick ass at? I may want to challenge you.

I kick ass at very few but put a spirited performance into Taiko No Tatsujin whenever I have an arcade and fifteen minutes handy.

Also DDR but that's slightly harder to find in my corner of Japan. Also also I never wear the right kit to it and get hot and worn out waaay too easily.

Nice flava TehPilot!

awesome flavor

hhhhhhhhhhhh town

okay I give Vic credit he played better than normal and he wasn't coached.

He wasn't /town/ per se but he wasn't mafia either so I guess I owe you an apology.

Generally speaking, my closing thoughts:

I look forward to backreading through deadchat and mafiachat

I have disgraced myself and town with my failure to follow my intuition and my insistence on riding PalamedesLynch so damn hard.

In penance I'm going to go complete sudoku

I view 'flavor is just flavor' as a mod and a player, generally, because otherwise mass claims break the game, or at the very least make it inherently -fun.

I think role flavor should be viewed differently from event flavor - the first should obviously be (at least somewhat) spinnable as either side otherwise yeah mafia can't fake-claim at all.

However, event flavor can (should?) be tweaked such that it balances the power of a particular role/mechanic by making it more town or more scum-sounding; rewarding people who pay attention to flavor is something I think I like as an ideal?

See Garu's daykill event - while it didn't confirm he was town, it helped confirm his roleclaim in a reasonably town-sided way. Which is not something I think you need to tweak Pilot.

Similarly, the lynch janitoring and house-burning being somewhat suspicious (flavored as a 'police mixup' and well arson which was what the mafia started the game with oh my god) was also completely fair in my view - I mean if you actually think it through mechanically there's no way in hell the first isn't a scum power (and the second is a bit much for a marker, discarding the whole gamestart thing), but giving them an extra flavor kick is something I can totes get behind.


It's 7 in the morning and I've got to leave in a moment which means I haven't had the time to properly think this over and get my thoughts in a more coherent order so might follow up on this later.

E: Yeah pretty much inevitably going to have something up later

I'm pretty against flavor-reading. It makes the mod another variable and how much they choose to reveal--they then have the power to reveal information that helps town or information that helps scum. All up to the moderator.

That's why I'm kind of glad we have roles like the jan-vig from Radio Tower. It discourages people from reading too far into flavor.

That said, I'm a huge fan of good flavor in and of itself. It makes the game more memorable. Or maybe the setup, moreso.

>> jan-vig from Radio Tower

SpoilerShow

The Jan-vig's my baby :0

Flavour in events matching a role: good!
Flavour used to detect a particular role: good!
Flavour a la Teafia: let us not speak of it.

Game 'filler flavour' and role flavour generally shouldn't be biased unless it is in the opening post or the day one post and by that i mean story elements that relate to character flavour are okay so long as game altering hints arent embedded once the game actually begins.