Nostalgfia - GAME OVER SCUM WIN

God, I rechecked my quicktopic like twice and there is ABSOLUTELY no poisons in my inventory in my results.

I suppose during the action summarization, I did had poison (???) but I got redirected/thieved so that's why Sunspider can see poison but I can't see any in my quicktopic.

N1: Toilet paper

N2: None

N3: 3 toilet tubes, 2 glass lens, an orange, fedora, tinfoil and bone.

N4: 3 toilet tubes, 2 glass lens, an orange, fedora, tinfoil and bone.

Sunspider, I like you but honestly, this goddamn mafia is getting way too long and GETTING real annoyed with Mafia In General, especially with the Day Extensions, the Post Accelerando, and the fact you been trying to grill me every time you have the opportunity. ANANNANNAANANGHUGUGUGH.

Especially with POETRY.

@pharms by 'I did had poison' do you mean 'I could have had poison'? but yeah I think I see what you mean by that hypothetical, and I don't think that's how that would work so Welp.

also the rest of your items straight-up don't match up with what Sunspider said you had so... yeah idk what to believe even if sunspider flips not!mafia, bc it seems an awful lot like some sort of weird redirection or misunderstanding might have hit a 3p!sunspider in that case rather than you being actual scum, idk

yeah, I remember the “2 nights back” thing, but then I think I had some kind of...dream fragment that’s indistinguishable from reality where she said it was actually n2 lol
I don’t really understand how Sunspider’s role is supposed to work (viewing items BEFORE other moves go???) so it’s hard to parse some of this

although it bears saying that IF there was a 1-way bus off of pharmacy onto possible scum then that COULD account for RL’s result? though honestly that would leave me still suspicious of Reyweld since all the theorizing about driving without being willing to commit had the vibe of someone who KNOWS there was a bus and that this “should” get them off the hook but who can’t come out and say so directly
this is just hypothetical though

@mirdini the latter yeah. god now i'm just kinda believing I have immunities cuz apparently I'm a busdriver who is invisible? but is a poison and watcher immune busdriver too op.

Hey correct me if I'm wrong Sunspider but if you're a survivor you're actually more on scum's side aren't you? You know, since once it hits endgame you can just vote with them and win.

unvote, I've been swayed. I still think trying to lynch the scum driver or inventor is the safer bet since they can more readily mess with us while a Sunspider thief needs to take a shot in the dark to hit Mirdini, but I'll vote that way if that's how it needs to go.

Vote: Akumu

I mean, I still think Akumu's dying tonight by his own self, is the thing. That annoyed-post seemed pretty legit to me and that means lynching him now is kind of... wasting a lynch when lynches are in short supply

Voteses:

Nercania: (1) (Schazer)
Akumu: (2) (Seedy, Palamedes)
Pharmacy: (1) (Sunspider)
Reyweld: (1) (Akumu)
Sunspider: (3) (Robust Laser, Reyweld, Mirdini)
Abstaining: (3) (nercania-orccelga, pharmacy,Wheat)

6 to Hard Lynch, 3 to Soft Lynch, deadline is 10:30 PM CST, July 14th, ~51 hours from now

honestly if it comes down to it I think either a Sunspider lynch or an N-O lynch is the way to go.

and I'm still leaning on lynching Spoids bc while she sounds pretty believable, scum can certainly sound pretty believable when they want to. And that role feels pretty weird, as does the poison counter-claim deal with pharms. And worst case if she is a 3P survivor that saves us a headache at a possible LYLO anyway.

Like, the risk of a mafia!sunspider stealing either an antidote (to give to Akumu and thus making sure he survives the night) or stealing another useful item is much larger than the risk of Akumu redirecting one more time (if that's the role he is), imo.

Now this would all be moot if I could get an update that says my surprise item that will help us later can help us now, but unfortunately I'm thinking that's probably not the world we live in.

hmm, yeah
unvote for now
Akumu...feels like they really are dying but also I dunno why they didn’t mention it sooner...you’d think they’d want to try and draw an antidote? I’m sort of worried that aside from lying there’s enough other kills floating around that...they’d be able to get to mylo tomorrow and joint with someone. though I guess if Sunspider really is a survivor then whatever other 3ps may or may not exist probably won’t be the kind that can joint? but the possibility is there
ofc no matter what we do mylo is nipping at our heels so vOv

I don’t really understand how Sunspider’s role is supposed to work (viewing items BEFORE other moves go???) so it’s hard to parse some of this

Tried to explain how it goes already; its pretty simple. Night falls, I post a Thief target, mod PMs me that players inventory before other night actions are confirmed or resolved, and I decide whether or not to steal from them based on the info. I haven't stolen yet, so don't know how actions resolve were I redirected, but when roleblocked by the Turkish Delight, I got an item list but no choice to steal or not; I was just blocked after item scanning Nola.

---

Not trying to contribute to a negative attitude Pharmacy, so sorry if I've done that. Buuuut how/why are you unsure if you have a poisoner role w/ poison immunity, etc? Why can't you confirm that?

hmm, yeah
unvote for now
Akumu...feels like they really are dying but also I dunno why they didn’t mention it sooner...you’d think they’d want to try and draw an antidote?

I mean, Akumu brought it up in his first post of the day (long before you claimed) after just being completely absent yesterday so I feel like he might’ve mentioned it as soon as remembered the game existed/felt like looking at it again in the hopes of, not dying to poison

demoralized mafiosi are a thing n’ all

plus he did claim he was the one that sent me poison and I think with all the poison we’ve seen it was probably handed to me by someone rather than generated - mafia jusr being able to conju up infinite poison would feel a bit OP

@spoids presumably bc pharms was also not aware her busdriving was untraceable, and is wondering if it’s possible her role has other secret aspects

@wheat there’s a difference between ‘townish weird claim’ + the kindnof stuff I’ve seen out of RL and Spoids’ ebtirely reasonable-sounding 3p claim after the closest thing to a guilty this game has

that being said two scientists does suggest a 3p or two bc that also makes them less powerful; it also makes RL’s claim of specifically checking for mafia (and 3ps checking as town) kinda more believable, I feel

but yeah still feeling reasonably confident re: a scum team of 2-3 of

Akumu/N-O/Sunspider and then maybe 1 out of Reyweld/Pharmacy/Robust Laser

really wish we had some way of cutting that latter Gordian knot without a reasonable risk of 2ish mislynches, though.

Also @wheat ty for leaving out the rest of my reasoning for why i think a Sunspider lynch is the way to go rn, even if I had RL and Sunspider down as equally scummy role considerations would make me wanna lynch Spoids

(ie worst case scenario if Sunspider is a mafia thief she can save Akumu and force us to use a lynch on him or steal another very useful item, if RL is scum item maker or w/e he can maybe just bomb someone again, and with Pharms bussing seedy it won’t be our most pivotsl role)

Also Seedy re: MYLO yeah that’s coming up if we do lynch a 3p survivor but otoh we def don’t want a 3p survivor still around at that point and also we have in the worst case an Akumu lynch on the table tomorrow (if he’s somehow lying about poison or gets saved somehow) which means it at least can’t be a mylo we mess up tomorrow, even if my poison ends up killing me come Day 7 bc weird shit happens with antidotes or something (at which point d7 would be 6 alive with presumably 2 scum)

call me crazy but i don't think "scum can be believable sometimes" is inherently contradictory to "i believe this seems honest in this particular case"

like is this just another "i want to see who will go along with it" situation or is this flimsy excuse for a vote an actual accusation this time

so wheat do you think this is a “2 godfathers” game ooooorrrrrrrrrrr what
or are you afraid to say that cuz it’d mess with your townfirm?

claiming w/ no prompting/ostensibly to share an either/or guilty check vs. claiming after a guilty...it’s no surprise that would affect the believability of a claim?

*dog demonstrates that they dug that up bc not only was it a very scummy meaningless statement of junk reasoning ("scum can be believable, so i dont believe the claim being believable" wtf) but mirdini previously has gone on believability of claims, contradicting it*

*votes mirdini*

laser's already pointed out why you're off the mark here but

I'm this close to done trying to argue with you because you keep seizing on these points that aren't even actual contradictions like a dog with a bone

like, you were like this when we were lynching CB, you were like this when we were lynching CSJ, while it's possible Sunspider is telling the truth and IS a 3P survivor, why do *you* think that's so likely to be the case over her being mafia who has fakeclaimed that after being caught in a scientist check

and why does that make me a better lynch than the person who you actually think is scum? not agreeing with your conclusions is not necessarily a scum tell, see again day 2 and day 3 lynches where you were saying the exact same stuff about me bc I didn't want to lynch n-o at the time

I think Sunspider's claim is believable. I think Robust Laser's claim is believable.

The difference between the two is I think the rest of Robust Laser's play has been townier than Sunspider's, whereas Sunspider's poison story re: Pharmacy, the fact she's checked non-town, and the fact that we've seen a bunch of double-roles on the town side but none so far on the mafia side make me think there's a fair shot that she's mafia.

Additionally, there's the mitigating factor of 'if Robust Laser is scum, we probably just get some more bombs in the night. If Sunspider is scum, she can steal an antidote and give it to Akumu to save him or steal some other pretty critical items that would swing the game for scum'.

Also, there's always the possibility that they're BOTH scum! In which case as stated above, I'd prefer Sunspider die first.

I don't know if I've somehow come off like I think RL is confirmed town - I don't.

I think Laser is less likely to be scum than Sunspider/N-O/Akumu, currently. If one out of those 3 turns out to be not-mafia, RL/Pharmacy/Reyweld are all back in the picture at roughly equal levels of suspicious for me, with the difference depending somewhat on which of the former 3 turned out to be not-mafia

*dog thinks you have had faulty reasoning all game in the style of posting a lot of words to make it seem like you are town, but with assumptions or statements that are glaringly wrong like "laser is newish town" when they were playing mafia on mspa before you*

when I say newish town I don't mean actually new to mafia town, but playing like they haven't played much mafia recently, which I believe is the case, because

agh i'm sorry i don't know what to do

[....]

Wait, a miller claim?

........So my role is like, really really hard to use.

And the possible existence of millers would make it more or less impossible to interpret my results.
And I sure don't know how likely it would be for that sort of situation to be set up, but if this game is supposed to have fair roles, then I think that claim might be bullshit!
Vote: Seedy

Yeah my current thoughts are that maybe I'm just bad at mafia.

of this stuff etc.

like, as much as you accuse me of 'assumptions or statements that are glaringly wrong' so far everything I've said that you've dredged up that's supposed to be that feels a lot more like you're deliberately misinterpreting what I'm trying to say!

which is getting kind of frustrating!

I think Sunspider's claim is believable. I think Robust Laser's claim is believable.

The difference between the two is I think the rest of Robust Laser's play has been townier than Sunspider's, whereas Sunspider's poison story re: Pharmacy, the fact she's checked non-town, and the fact that we've seen a bunch of double-roles on the town side but none so far on the mafia side make me think there's a fair shot that she's mafia.

I take offense to the fact that my play hasn't been town. I've been pressuring 2 players who flipped scum the start and consistently voted to kill 'em. Dunno if Laser or even you can say the same. Not to mention y'alls ignoring of Pharm's scummy butt, and glossing over their inability to even be sure of their own role publically, which I don't even know what to make of!

That aside, let's do a quick fact check, because you got the bolded part up there all wrong. We've had no double-role town players in our roleflips excepting Solaris the Mason/Doctor, who was the only dual-role, and as a Mason is only barely a dual role; everyone else is single role, so I don't even know where you're getting this. Moreover, half of flipped scum are dual roles (Godfather/Petty Thief, since there's only 2). At best, we have 1 dual role on each team; the tendency you cited doesn't even exist.

So yeah, to Wheat's point either you're not fact-checking yourself on what you're saying, or you're doing the late game "Try to appear useful and talk a lot to stay alive" thing, and if we're being uncharitable maybe even the "misrepresent the facts intentionally to sway the players too lazy to fact check you into not lynching you or your remaining scumbuddy" thing that Scum do late game.

Anyway, gotta go get our car fixed, because we broke down out west. Before I go, a quote from the OP, for the lazy looking to fact check Mirdini:

1. Schazer
2. Wheat
3. Akumu
4. Sunspider
5. Robust Laser
6. AgentBlue=>Reyweld
7. nercania-orccelga
8. RobottobtTown Scientist
9. CSJ Mafia Godfather/Petty Thief
10. Mirdini
11. Coldblooded Mafia Roleblocker
12. SinkingSailor Town Roleblocker
13. awkwardcarapace Town Item Crafter
14. a52Town Watcher
15. GranolamanTown Item Crafter
16. seedy
17. Palamedes
18. Pharmacy
19. Solaris Town Doctor/Mason
20. Cat Town Mailman

PLAYING MAFIA IN A CHATROOM SETTING IS SO DRASTICALLY DIFFERENT THAN PLAYING IN A PLAY BY POST SETTING


i don't have to like, read giant fucking walls of text multiple times to try and understand what might be going on and people have wayyyy more limited time to make decisions and arguments and it's just so much easier to go with the flow when you see somebody say something and you want to respond while it's still relevant and before it scrolls off the top of the screen